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Level-3 Schedule

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Shazia khan
User offline. Last seen 2 years 35 weeks ago. Offline
Joined: 21 Apr 2008
Posts: 139

Hi -Experts,

We got (awarded) one project that is Chemical Plant Project size is small .project duration is 13 Months,

Project manager asking me to prepare a L3 schedule while i do not have enough information to do so,

information like Procurement , duration (vendor delivery time) for project Equipment and material, Nos of Engineering Drawings, for Process,Civil , mach,

 i have only Bid Schedule which is Master Schedule with overall duration  for EPC.

I know Plot plan of the Project under preparation  , client has issue only ref.p & IDs  , while i ask to discipline Engineers to provide me information for L3 schedule, they said we need couple of days to estimate the nos of  Drawings and Docs,

My Project manager pushing me hard to finalize the schedule, i never work before with this kind of PM.

Please let me know what is the way to prepare a L3 schedule with out detail information for PM as well as Client.

How i can reply to project manager, even he is aware of all situation.

 

Please Help me with your wide experience,

Thanks in advance and best regards

Replies

Alex Iskandar
User offline. Last seen 18 weeks 5 days ago. Offline
Joined: 2 Jan 2004
Posts: 5

Indded, I'm inline with Shahul,

I would say to build the schedule have to start from the structure as we call it WBS and it should be from the Contract Scope Of Work.

As per my experience to build up the WBS as folllows:

level 0,

Level 1, E,P,C,I and close out (you may add your P6 schedule the milestones WBS to ease the roll up review)

Level 2 further ...

Engineering broked down in to the: Diciplines (it may vary depend on your organization and client requirements (Process, Civil & structural, Instrumentation, Piping, Mechanical, Electrical & Construction/Installation engineering), Then further Deliverables, And if might required to further level, the step of works, draft, IDC, IFR,IFA ...

Procurement broked down into the: Company (Owner) supplies (if any) , and Contractor Supplies, and further by Diciplines level 2, then further by equipments per diciplines.. start with the main equipments ...

 

Construction, I would prefer System/Area/Unit -Contract Object, further broke down into the diciplines ...vice versa ... you may also start from Diciplines..then go to Area/System/Unit - Contract Object

Instllation (if it is on offshore)

Precom & Comm: Pre-Comissioning Activitiies and Comissining Activities

And last but not least:

Prject Close Out: Final Documentation, As Built Drawings, Contractual Close Out and Lesson learned...

 

And bring your team (all diciiplines to discuss the structure, duration and traget / milestones)

Hope it helps,

 

Warmes Regards from Indonesia

Alex Iskandar

Daniel Limson
User offline. Last seen 2 days 12 hours ago. Offline
Joined: 13 Oct 2001
Posts: 318

Shazia,

Since your project is a design and build project, obviously you do not have enough information to do a detailed programme. However, a Level 3 programme can actually be done. Your PM just wants to have a clear guide or a road map on when activities should happen. Based on your high level programme, Work your level 3 construction activities from start to completion. I would imagine your activities will start from site formation, exacation, foundation, structural works, process piping, E&M works, instrumentation, and T&C. (broken down into sub areas) You need to identify the window where you need to start installation of your major equipments, You also need to identify major equipments and their lead times and work backwards to find out when you need to procure this items, work further backwards and find out when yo need to finish the design works so that you can procure and build the project within 13 months. It sounds like a pretty fast track project. Your design, procurement and construction activities may actually overlap, for example you may actually be doing your foundation works while the process piping, E&M and Instrumentation is still being design. Your engineering deliverables should also be at level 3 by discipline i.e. foundations, structural, process piping, etc.

Hope this helps you with your task.

Best regards,

Daniel

Shazia khan
User offline. Last seen 2 years 35 weeks ago. Offline
Joined: 21 Apr 2008
Posts: 139

Sir

Thanks so Much for your quick response,

I will fallow same step for my work,

in Level-1 Schedule , Linked  as fellows.

 

Engineering approval finish- procurement start, delivery of material at site construction work which need Material will be start,

 

 

Level 3

during material Delevery ,(float) Excavations , Leveling, work to be finished,say Shuttering Material and Iron Bar, deliver at site,

PC must finish like that i will l link level 3 Schedule,

 

I am very grateful to you i got confidence with your reply, what i have done Level-1 Schedule its ok,

Thanks for Advise

Best Regards

aaaaaaaaa aaaaaaa...
User offline. Last seen 3 years 50 weeks ago. Offline
Joined: 24 Dec 2008
Posts: 7

SHAZIA,

            I think you managers seem like  typical manager, you need not have to worry , since you have already prepared level 1 schedule.

Concerntrate on the construction part .

1) Fix the start date for your construction , divide your constuction part  into areas and sub areas as per you drawings , list out the activities by refering into detailed drawings sections .

2)Co- ordinate with your construction and MEP team for the sequence of work for different areas. Make on template for one particular area and get approval for the same for the list of activities and copy part for rest of area.

3)For procurement it will be expected or tentative required date based on your construction dates except for the long lead item .

4) same for the Expected drawing deliverables

LINK DESIGN WITH PROCUREMENTAND CONSTRUCTION ACTIVITIES

LINK PROCUREMENT WITH CONSTRUCTION

LINK CONSTRUCTION TO TESTING AND COMMISSIONING WHICH WILL BE FURTHER LINKED TO YOU FINAL COMPLETION MILESTONE .

Shazia khan
User offline. Last seen 2 years 35 weeks ago. Offline
Joined: 21 Apr 2008
Posts: 139

Thanks for all of you, and your advise,

 

I already made a master Schedule for PM that is L1 all milestone and key dates , main Engineering , Procurement , and Construction Activities , and their Duration,

Now PM wants L3, i told him i need detail , from Engineering, Procurement and Construction,( Sub-Contractor Schedule)

I have taken all required info. from BID docs, like main item Building Material, Layout, Process P& IDs Equipment, main Valves , and filter Pumps , pipes for procurement,

but i do not know Supplier delivery time it can only done after Vendor response which is pending ,for all material,

I have total duration for Engineering, means all engineering has to be done with in this duration but i do not know how many Drgs & Layout engineering Department Prepared,

Please advise, if i am assumption is correct

I can assume 30 drgs,  which will be finish with in duration , if qty,increase i can further break down,

Procumbent  how i can assume --------------------------please advise

Construction:  for Building how i can assume --------------------------------------Please advise

 I  had meeting with Civil Depart they are preparing building schedule.

Please provide me some guidance with your experience how to come out with this situation.

 

Best Regards

 

 

aaaaaaaaa aaaaaaa...
User offline. Last seen 3 years 50 weeks ago. Offline
Joined: 24 Dec 2008
Posts: 7

shazia,

       Arrange meeting with your Technical, Procument,commercial and Construction Incharge for the scope of work,This will give you rough Idea .

Prepare level 1 schedule first with Design ( key Information related to client ) linked with your procuerment wwhich will be further linked to the Construction .

Let respective dept head to agree on the level 1 before you proceed to level 3 stage.

Once your level 1 logic senquence is agreed, then your step to detail further consulting your dept heads or you may use tender documents and drawings .

Sometimes you may not get all the required details in some cases you may need to assume certain data .

If you find further queries let me know

 

 

 

 

Daniel Limson
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Joined: 13 Oct 2001
Posts: 318

Shazia,

Get a copy of the tender documents. Everything you need to find out about the project should be in those documents.

Basically, what you need to find out from the documents are the following:

Scope of work

Commencement dates and completion dates.

Contract requirements. i.e. Key Dates, Access Dates, Return Dates/handover dates, Milestone dates, Interface dates that you need to meet (if any).

Bill of Quantities - You can get here your major materials and equipments and corresponding quantities to determine your activity duration and resources required based on production rates in your area or past experience.

Drawings - review the drawings.

Normally, the project was awarded to your company based on your technical and commercial proposals (your tender) so ask the people in your home office for these documents and your programme should be in line with this proposal.

Since your project is a chemical process plant, you need to review the structural, piping and instrumentation drawings so you can plan a strategy on how you wanna build it.

Best regards,

Daniel

 

Build a WBS Engg,procurement & Construction,Testing& commissioning and hand over .Add activities with limited in number with the duration that satisfies each WBS .You can create a simple one based on the master schedule as base

D Artagnan
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Joined: 19 Sep 2008
Posts: 205

You don't really expect the PM to give you out all the information. As planner, you don't really expect that all the information is served to you in a silver platter in a blink. As with your case, what you can do is start listing activities that you theoritically know, duration, resources, etc. Then you can start listing all that are vague or activities that you are totally clueless about. I bet you're not the only one involved in the project and with the list seek for assistance from engineers. They surely will cooperate and give you their technical expertise. For the procurement and technical submittals, ask the head of the respective department.

Another option is, find a suitable template for the project and reference for productivity rates.

As planner, you really have to do the leg work. With these you can create a schedule which might not be as perfect as everyone wants but at least it should be workable. I've worked with some managers who just use the schedule for contractual requirement but not for the main purpose (to guide the project) but I hope your case is not the same.

rrr4all
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all the best for making a failed schedule without information and base........

rrr4all
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Joined: 19 Sep 2010
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all the best for making a failed schedule without information and base........