Vladimir,
Thanks for allowing this to get back on the correct topic
Seems to be a lot of posts being hijacked for different reasons & may deter people from using the forum to seek advice.
Steven
Chris,If you use the method that Rafael suggested in his first post along with the comment from Santosh then this should give you what you want.You could manually create a Filter for each resource (Where Resource IDs equals then add value), however using the Resource Usage Profile & ticking the Resource option at the bottom left does the same thing without having to create multiple filters.Please note that you must have the Resource Usage Filter showing "Current Project's Resources" and under the Gantt Chart Area where is states "Display: Open Projects Only" - If you click the down arrow and make sure that "Show All Projects" does not have a tick before it then you will be able to select the option under "Display Activities for selected..." for either all activities for that Resource, or by Time Period (Use the shift Key to select the date range on the Resource Usage Profile area under the Gantt Chart to limit by Resource & Time Period.If the "Display Activities for selected..." is greyed out then one of the options above need to be corrected.From Santosh's Post:1) Select VIEW>SHOW ON BOTTOM > RESOURCE USAGE PROFILEYou'll see a list of all the resources that are assigned to the proejcts you have open.2) Right at the bottom, tick the box next to "Resource" to only show activities that have the selected resource assigned to them3) Then have your Grouping and Sorting for the top half however you want (wbs, activity codes etc)From Rafael's Post:<a href="https://docs.oracle.com/cd/E75426_01/client_help/en_US/helpmain.htm?toc… Zoltan states, you can show multiple resources at the same time, by holding down the Control Key & selecting the Resource Names from the list.Regards,Steven
Vladimir, Of course it will be natural for you to be bias :-) Now I guess we're only talking about Construction Schedules per se (given with full engineering details). What if your contract includes "Detailed Engineering"; Will it be valid to just pick up some details from your "fragments library" or templates or whatever you call it, to be used in your construction schedule? Of course Not! So that's why I think it's useless. Templates are just for amateurs. Well, perhaps there would be some useful details, but as you know, professional engineers do their own method statements for construction depending on the engineered specifications. So I would suggest that you scrap your fragments library or templates and just think that every project is unique :-). Just focus on how to formulate automatic resource leveling without using pre-defined data, but always fresh data from any user.
Anoon, I agree that durations from nowhere are common and usually exist in high level schedules prepared in a hurry for rough estimates of project duration.But real schedule that may be used for resource management shall be based on the detailed information (drawings, 3D model, etc.) where physical volumes of work (not as hours or currencies but as cubic meters or tons) are known. It is common that contractors use two (or more) schedules – one for contract management (high level) and another one based on detailed information for own resource management. Using templates (typical fragments) and reference-books of the corporate norms is usual among our customers. P6 does not work with activity volumes and resource productivities and so it was not designed for using any kind of norms. I expect that this is one of the reasons you don’t believe in their usefulness.
Vladimir, Perhaps you've never noticed it at your level (Durations from nowhere), but for me, coming from the grounds, it is always a fact. Preparation of a comprehensive schedule is always timed constrained (not mentioning the technical constraints), so contractors have no other way but to just put their best guesses. Anyway, regarding "Activity Volume", it is my understanding (I for one), that this can only be derived through conversions and shall just arrive to two (2) discrete and/or common unit, such as: "Hours" or "Currencies" (your Choice). And I'm sure you knew how flawed it is (sorry for EV users or advocates). Now for: "Fragments Library" or Templates, sorry I never believe in those kind of things. I guess these are the ones that causes the problems in scheduling as well. As the scheduler may thought that his/her job is easy and may miss the real thing. Other ideal matters, I agree with you. And yes, "Automatic Resource Leveling" should be the only way forward. And much better if backed-up by multi-dimensional modeling.
Anoon,Durations derived from nowhere is poor practice.Activity volume is a real thing. We measure wall volume in physical units and define material consumptions per volume unit. It is not rare when activity volume and material consumption are measured in different units (like requirements of number of bricks per 1sqm of the brick wall). It is also usual when materials that are required per volume unit exceed 1 per 1 even if measured in the same units (1.02 m3 of concrete per 1m3 of concrete wall).Yes, the crew consists of discrete resources (people and machines) and some of these resources are driving (have certain productivity) and others are supportive (zero productivity). Assigned crew productivity determines activity duration.We suggest to create the library of typical fragments describing the technology of building typical elements (walls, columns, floors, 100m of road, etc.) and use these fragments as building blocks creating project schedule. It is usual that such elements exist in many projects though in different combination. So the schedules shall not be copied but some elements are the same in many schedules.Creating typical fragment library and reference-books (databases) of construction norms (material requirements per volume unit on different activity types, resource productivity on typical assignments, etc.) we can avoid subjective estimates in the project model.Even when the planner is an experienced engineer, we insist on involving other team members in creating project schedules. If people were involved they buy the schedule and are trying to do their best to follow it because the schedule is theirs. And besides one person cannot be the best in all areas. But yes, project planner shall deeply understand project processes. In other case he/she may miss wrong estimates and important dependencies. Project planner shall use the same language (I don’t mean national languages) as other project participants and have certain authority not defined by his/her ability to master P6 or Spider Project.
Vladimir, The fact is, most durations were derived from nowhere. And there is no such thing as volume of activity, but discrete volume of materials and discrete number of skilled or human resources; and discrete number of tools and/or equipment. In other words, 1 + 1 = 1 each. Another worst fact is, most schedules were copied from nowhere as well (forgetting that: "each and every project is unique"). And again, another fact is (or maybe not?), due to proliferation of so-called planning or portfolio management software, perhaps most people thought that planning and construction scheduling can also be done by anyone for as long as he/she knows how to handle or use the software. Again, forgetting various engineering disciplines. So why take a masters or Phd, when you were already a master of P6, Spider, AstaPP, MSP, or whatever? Yes, we are in agreement in terms of principles (I guess?).
Yes, most durations are derived from the productivity rates. And resource productivity is activity volume (not material!) that this resource can do in one hour.There are certain requirements for activities in resource loaded schedules. In particular an activity shall be measurable (its volume may be defined in certain physical units like meter, ton, etc.) and assigned resource crew shall do it from the beginning to the end with certain productivity (that is the sum of productivities of crew resources).If the schedule was developed properly automatic resource leveling is the only way that is practical.
Yes Vladimir, I don't have any problem with resource leveling, maybe others have, as most schedules I believe cannot level resources correctly even when using a software. So there must be something wrong with the schedules or activities even without resource loading. As far as I know, durations were derived from productivity rates, and productivity rates were derived from discrete units of human resource and/or equipment against a certain material. I think the problem emanates from the assumptions that perhaps multiple discrete units can be combined as one. What do you think and why is this happening? I mean the problem in automatic resource leveling.
Anoon, I don't understand your point.Of course the schedule shall reflect real life assignments and constraints.And of course construction crews assigned to project activities consist of multiple resouces.And of course the schedule shall be verified and approved by those who do the job.And of course they shall participate in schedule development.And it is useful to analyze resource plans and be able to get the reports on any resource assignments in the project schedule.Are we in agreement with the statements above?If yes then please also explain what is the problem with resource leveling you wrote about?
Here's a Clue: "Leveling Effort Instead of Quantity is WRONG" by: Rafael Davila. For me, this is just a simple statement that can make huge difference in your existing scheduling principles (if any), if understood. However, I guess most Schedules were just copied from available templates with similar descriptions and the innocent scheduler commanded by a similarly innocent project manager, will just adopt the template. And the result is, for a building project for example: Construction Activities usually start with one Activity: Construct Foundation (assigned or loaded with multiple resources - everything ALL IN). Believe me, construction scheduling is not a poker game where sometimes you get lucky! So everyone, please check your schedules, if you have one as mentioned, then you can never have a correct resource leveling or your schedule is WRONG!
Rafael, Filtering (and organizing) in P6 is very flexible and easy if you know exactly what you're doing. The most common mistake is (or are): If the perception or activities in the schedule were WRONG in the first place. And perhaps most (again, if not ALL) Schedulers thought that it's just Ok to assign multiple resources to a certain activity, and the software shall automatically work wonders for them (i.e. in terms of real construction and resource leveling). That belief (for me - I for one), is just a FANTASY! The fact is, if you have started a wrong activity in your resource loaded schedule, then for sure everything will be wrong. For those who happened to read this post and have their resource loaded schedules in front of them, I'm sure you cannot figure out how to level your resources (and perhaps thinking that P6 is an idiot - or in front of the monitor). Don't Lie! Anyway, it's one of the reasons why you stay on the job. And there were lots of excuses anyway, like: Your resource loading is never followed in the field (again this is a fact). And you might be even proud to ask the field personnel if what exactly they're doing, and why they don't exactly follow your schedule (even if the installations were actually right). Oh, I broke my spectacles...to be continued later...
In my opinion (at least from my own experience), almost ALL (if not ALL - of course not including mine) schedules that involved "Concreting Works" are problematic if not WRONG because of so-called schedulers pretending to be engineers who really know construction. A simple concrete footing may become complicated if perceived wrongly in a schedule. WHY? Try one activity: Concrete Footing and assign multiple resources: i.e. Carpenters; Steel-Fixers; Masons; Laborers; Say: 1. Concrete Footing with 5 days duration (assigned with resources as mentioned). Try to level your resources. If you cannot do it, add: 2. Footing Tie Beam, also 5 days and the same resources. Finish-to-Start (1->2). Again, for me, this kind of scheduling is very WRONG! You find out WHY?
Anoon this will not help if you have multiple resources on an activity ie F/R/P you have carpenters formingRob busters doing the rebarlaborers pouring the concreteSantosh has the correct solution and you can pick the resource or multiple resources by holding down the control key
Ok i re-read to see you want to show the activity bars for a chosen resource, easy to do.1) Select VIEW>SHOW ON BOTTOM > RESOURCE USAGE PROFILEYou'll see a list of all the resources that are assigned to the proejcts you have open.2) Right at the bottom, tick the box next to "Resource" to only show activities that have the selected resource assigned to them3) Then have your Grouping and Sorting for the top half however you want (wbs, activity codes etc)
Oh I'm sorry, perhaps I misunderstood your intention. Why not use "activity codes" i.e. Under "Responsibility"? Assign codes to your activities under a certain resource and filter to whatever you want. Will this help?
Chris, IMO, this is not what you want, or what you want may not be practicable. Let me borrow Rafael's: "Leveling Effort Instead of Quantity is Wrong". This statement is right due to the fact that "Efforts" are always VARIABLE at any certain time and situation. Scheduling always refer to time. The metrics for scheduling may use "Constants" and "Variables". Again, IMO, variables are unpredictable or volatile. What I'm trying to say? Hmm..what makes sense to you, may not make sense to others. Though there were some who even thought of banning "tasks" and "logics or relationships" in a schedule, I still cannot think if how can this be possible.
Chris, think of it this way, the activity view only shows any activity once, even if it has multiple resources. You might want to try using the resource assignment view instead of the activity view where, every resource is only shown once and an activity can be shown multiple times. The filtering is also different in the Resource assignments view.
Vladimir, Thanks for allowing
Vladimir,
Thanks for allowing this to get back on the correct topic
Seems to be a lot of posts being hijacked for different reasons & may deter people from using the forum to seek advice.
Steven
Anoon,I suggest to continue
Anoon,I suggest to continue our discussion here http://www.planningplanet.com/forums/spider-project/732512/reference-bo… does not fit to the topic of this thread.
Chris,If you use the method
Chris,If you use the method that Rafael suggested in his first post along with the comment from Santosh then this should give you what you want.You could manually create a Filter for each resource (Where Resource IDs equals then add value), however using the Resource Usage Profile & ticking the Resource option at the bottom left does the same thing without having to create multiple filters.Please note that you must have the Resource Usage Filter showing "Current Project's Resources" and under the Gantt Chart Area where is states "Display: Open Projects Only" - If you click the down arrow and make sure that "Show All Projects" does not have a tick before it then you will be able to select the option under "Display Activities for selected..." for either all activities for that Resource, or by Time Period (Use the shift Key to select the date range on the Resource Usage Profile area under the Gantt Chart to limit by Resource & Time Period.If the "Display Activities for selected..." is greyed out then one of the options above need to be corrected.From Santosh's Post:1) Select VIEW>SHOW ON BOTTOM > RESOURCE USAGE PROFILEYou'll see a list of all the resources that are assigned to the proejcts you have open.2) Right at the bottom, tick the box next to "Resource" to only show activities that have the selected resource assigned to them3) Then have your Grouping and Sorting for the top half however you want (wbs, activity codes etc)From Rafael's Post:<a href="https://docs.oracle.com/cd/E75426_01/client_help/en_US/helpmain.htm?toc… Zoltan states, you can show multiple resources at the same time, by holding down the Control Key & selecting the Resource Names from the list.Regards,Steven
Vladimir, Of course it will
Vladimir, Of course it will be natural for you to be bias :-) Now I guess we're only talking about Construction Schedules per se (given with full engineering details). What if your contract includes "Detailed Engineering"; Will it be valid to just pick up some details from your "fragments library" or templates or whatever you call it, to be used in your construction schedule? Of course Not! So that's why I think it's useless. Templates are just for amateurs. Well, perhaps there would be some useful details, but as you know, professional engineers do their own method statements for construction depending on the engineered specifications. So I would suggest that you scrap your fragments library or templates and just think that every project is unique :-). Just focus on how to formulate automatic resource leveling without using pre-defined data, but always fresh data from any user.
Anoon, I agree that durations
Anoon, I agree that durations from nowhere are common and usually exist in high level schedules prepared in a hurry for rough estimates of project duration.But real schedule that may be used for resource management shall be based on the detailed information (drawings, 3D model, etc.) where physical volumes of work (not as hours or currencies but as cubic meters or tons) are known. It is common that contractors use two (or more) schedules – one for contract management (high level) and another one based on detailed information for own resource management. Using templates (typical fragments) and reference-books of the corporate norms is usual among our customers. P6 does not work with activity volumes and resource productivities and so it was not designed for using any kind of norms. I expect that this is one of the reasons you don’t believe in their usefulness.
Vladimir, Perhaps you've
Vladimir, Perhaps you've never noticed it at your level (Durations from nowhere), but for me, coming from the grounds, it is always a fact. Preparation of a comprehensive schedule is always timed constrained (not mentioning the technical constraints), so contractors have no other way but to just put their best guesses. Anyway, regarding "Activity Volume", it is my understanding (I for one), that this can only be derived through conversions and shall just arrive to two (2) discrete and/or common unit, such as: "Hours" or "Currencies" (your Choice). And I'm sure you knew how flawed it is (sorry for EV users or advocates). Now for: "Fragments Library" or Templates, sorry I never believe in those kind of things. I guess these are the ones that causes the problems in scheduling as well. As the scheduler may thought that his/her job is easy and may miss the real thing. Other ideal matters, I agree with you. And yes, "Automatic Resource Leveling" should be the only way forward. And much better if backed-up by multi-dimensional modeling.
Anoon,Durations derived from
Anoon,Durations derived from nowhere is poor practice.Activity volume is a real thing. We measure wall volume in physical units and define material consumptions per volume unit. It is not rare when activity volume and material consumption are measured in different units (like requirements of number of bricks per 1sqm of the brick wall). It is also usual when materials that are required per volume unit exceed 1 per 1 even if measured in the same units (1.02 m3 of concrete per 1m3 of concrete wall).Yes, the crew consists of discrete resources (people and machines) and some of these resources are driving (have certain productivity) and others are supportive (zero productivity). Assigned crew productivity determines activity duration.We suggest to create the library of typical fragments describing the technology of building typical elements (walls, columns, floors, 100m of road, etc.) and use these fragments as building blocks creating project schedule. It is usual that such elements exist in many projects though in different combination. So the schedules shall not be copied but some elements are the same in many schedules.Creating typical fragment library and reference-books (databases) of construction norms (material requirements per volume unit on different activity types, resource productivity on typical assignments, etc.) we can avoid subjective estimates in the project model.Even when the planner is an experienced engineer, we insist on involving other team members in creating project schedules. If people were involved they buy the schedule and are trying to do their best to follow it because the schedule is theirs. And besides one person cannot be the best in all areas. But yes, project planner shall deeply understand project processes. In other case he/she may miss wrong estimates and important dependencies. Project planner shall use the same language (I don’t mean national languages) as other project participants and have certain authority not defined by his/her ability to master P6 or Spider Project.
Vladimir, The fact is, most
Vladimir, The fact is, most durations were derived from nowhere. And there is no such thing as volume of activity, but discrete volume of materials and discrete number of skilled or human resources; and discrete number of tools and/or equipment. In other words, 1 + 1 = 1 each. Another worst fact is, most schedules were copied from nowhere as well (forgetting that: "each and every project is unique"). And again, another fact is (or maybe not?), due to proliferation of so-called planning or portfolio management software, perhaps most people thought that planning and construction scheduling can also be done by anyone for as long as he/she knows how to handle or use the software. Again, forgetting various engineering disciplines. So why take a masters or Phd, when you were already a master of P6, Spider, AstaPP, MSP, or whatever? Yes, we are in agreement in terms of principles (I guess?).
Yes, most durations are
Yes, most durations are derived from the productivity rates. And resource productivity is activity volume (not material!) that this resource can do in one hour.There are certain requirements for activities in resource loaded schedules. In particular an activity shall be measurable (its volume may be defined in certain physical units like meter, ton, etc.) and assigned resource crew shall do it from the beginning to the end with certain productivity (that is the sum of productivities of crew resources).If the schedule was developed properly automatic resource leveling is the only way that is practical.
Alternatively:Try looking
Alternatively:Try looking pre-defined resource filters for Activity Gantt, similar to other software P6 might have such filters.<a href="https://postimg.cc/9w326NJs"></a> <a href="https://postimg.cc/DWZ7LGSp"></a> <a href="https://postimg.cc/dhnqh6VT"></a> <a href="https://postimg.cc/94nCpfTm"></a> Try looking pre-defined resource filters for Resource Gantt.<a href="https://postimg.cc/zHnN8SQv"></a> <a href="https://postimg.cc/cvdx120S"></a> <a href="https://postimg.cc/ph5x1tYD"></a>The need to filter by resources is so common that there must be an easy way.The need to organize by resources is so common that even old P3 would provide for it.<a href="https://docs.oracle.com/cd/E20557_01/documentation/P3/P330ref.pdf">http… expected if more than one resource is assigned to an activity, the activity is listed for each assigned resource group. See page 451.<a href="https://postimg.cc/jWh6DLWj"></a>Good luck.
Yes Vladimir, I don't have
Yes Vladimir, I don't have any problem with resource leveling, maybe others have, as most schedules I believe cannot level resources correctly even when using a software. So there must be something wrong with the schedules or activities even without resource loading. As far as I know, durations were derived from productivity rates, and productivity rates were derived from discrete units of human resource and/or equipment against a certain material. I think the problem emanates from the assumptions that perhaps multiple discrete units can be combined as one. What do you think and why is this happening? I mean the problem in automatic resource leveling.
Anoon, I don't understand
Anoon, I don't understand your point.Of course the schedule shall reflect real life assignments and constraints.And of course construction crews assigned to project activities consist of multiple resouces.And of course the schedule shall be verified and approved by those who do the job.And of course they shall participate in schedule development.And it is useful to analyze resource plans and be able to get the reports on any resource assignments in the project schedule.Are we in agreement with the statements above?If yes then please also explain what is the problem with resource leveling you wrote about?
Here's a Clue: "Leveling
Here's a Clue: "Leveling Effort Instead of Quantity is WRONG" by: Rafael Davila. For me, this is just a simple statement that can make huge difference in your existing scheduling principles (if any), if understood. However, I guess most Schedules were just copied from available templates with similar descriptions and the innocent scheduler commanded by a similarly innocent project manager, will just adopt the template. And the result is, for a building project for example: Construction Activities usually start with one Activity: Construct Foundation (assigned or loaded with multiple resources - everything ALL IN). Believe me, construction scheduling is not a poker game where sometimes you get lucky! So everyone, please check your schedules, if you have one as mentioned, then you can never have a correct resource leveling or your schedule is WRONG!
Rafael, Filtering (and
Rafael, Filtering (and organizing) in P6 is very flexible and easy if you know exactly what you're doing. The most common mistake is (or are): If the perception or activities in the schedule were WRONG in the first place. And perhaps most (again, if not ALL) Schedulers thought that it's just Ok to assign multiple resources to a certain activity, and the software shall automatically work wonders for them (i.e. in terms of real construction and resource leveling). That belief (for me - I for one), is just a FANTASY! The fact is, if you have started a wrong activity in your resource loaded schedule, then for sure everything will be wrong. For those who happened to read this post and have their resource loaded schedules in front of them, I'm sure you cannot figure out how to level your resources (and perhaps thinking that P6 is an idiot - or in front of the monitor). Don't Lie! Anyway, it's one of the reasons why you stay on the job. And there were lots of excuses anyway, like: Your resource loading is never followed in the field (again this is a fact). And you might be even proud to ask the field personnel if what exactly they're doing, and why they don't exactly follow your schedule (even if the installations were actually right). Oh, I broke my spectacles...to be continued later...
In my opinion (at least from
In my opinion (at least from my own experience), almost ALL (if not ALL - of course not including mine) schedules that involved "Concreting Works" are problematic if not WRONG because of so-called schedulers pretending to be engineers who really know construction. A simple concrete footing may become complicated if perceived wrongly in a schedule. WHY? Try one activity: Concrete Footing and assign multiple resources: i.e. Carpenters; Steel-Fixers; Masons; Laborers; Say: 1. Concrete Footing with 5 days duration (assigned with resources as mentioned). Try to level your resources. If you cannot do it, add: 2. Footing Tie Beam, also 5 days and the same resources. Finish-to-Start (1->2). Again, for me, this kind of scheduling is very WRONG! You find out WHY?
Anoon this will not help if
Anoon this will not help if you have multiple resources on an activity ie F/R/P you have carpenters formingRob busters doing the rebarlaborers pouring the concreteSantosh has the correct solution and you can pick the resource or multiple resources by holding down the control key
Ok i re-read to see you want
Ok i re-read to see you want to show the activity bars for a chosen resource, easy to do.1) Select VIEW>SHOW ON BOTTOM > RESOURCE USAGE PROFILEYou'll see a list of all the resources that are assigned to the proejcts you have open.2) Right at the bottom, tick the box next to "Resource" to only show activities that have the selected resource assigned to them3) Then have your Grouping and Sorting for the top half however you want (wbs, activity codes etc)
Oh I'm sorry, perhaps I
Oh I'm sorry, perhaps I misunderstood your intention. Why not use "activity codes" i.e. Under "Responsibility"? Assign codes to your activities under a certain resource and filter to whatever you want. Will this help?
Chris, IMO, this is not what
Chris, IMO, this is not what you want, or what you want may not be practicable. Let me borrow Rafael's: "Leveling Effort Instead of Quantity is Wrong". This statement is right due to the fact that "Efforts" are always VARIABLE at any certain time and situation. Scheduling always refer to time. The metrics for scheduling may use "Constants" and "Variables". Again, IMO, variables are unpredictable or volatile. What I'm trying to say? Hmm..what makes sense to you, may not make sense to others. Though there were some who even thought of banning "tasks" and "logics or relationships" in a schedule, I still cannot think if how can this be possible.
The following might
The following might help.<a href="https://docs.oracle.com/cd/E75426_01/client_help/en_US/helpmain.htm?toc… Luck
Chris, think of it this way,
Chris, think of it this way, the activity view only shows any activity once, even if it has multiple resources. You might want to try using the resource assignment view instead of the activity view where, every resource is only shown once and an activity can be shown multiple times. The filtering is also different in the Resource assignments view.