Dear Tim Readman
I hope you make the correct choice for your company.
I am an advocate of Powerproject as they have consistently listened to the wishes and needs of the man on the work face "THE PLANNER" and improved and developed it accordingly. But you have to examine both or all other software available and chose the one that delivers the end produce you require.
I have been in the field of construction planning since the days before computers were in use for planning in the UK and I have, in the past, worked with Darrell O’Dea, Garry France and David Bordoli who have made comments on this topic.
I remember the very shaky start of the introduction of the first software packages.
I was an Activities Organiser for the CIOB South London Committee going back a good few years now, when I organised a demonstration of a software for planning (I do not remember it’s name)for the CIOB members. The evening was not a success because the computers or the software kept crashing.
The story now is very different. There are so many good packages on the market that it is a problem find the one best suited for your specific end product requirements.
During the many years in the Planning Discipline I have used many planning software packages including, P3, Suretrak, Open Plan, Powerproject and others not now heard of much.
I loved the way you could manipulate the programme data via the use of their data bases in Open Plan and P3. But and this is a big "But" I did not like the fact that you had to work on the data in the dark. By this I mean that you did not see the effect of the build up or changes as you worked. You were in fact working the mechanics to achieve the end result i.e. the Bar Chart.
In around 1984 Microplanner planning software had a version for the DOS computers and one for MAC. They were two different ways of working. The DOS way working in the Engine Room the MAC way was making use of icons and graphics. The problem was that most of the industries in this country were into using the IBM processor and therefore it did not catch on.
The advent of MS Windows opened this method of using computers and made the use of software within the grasp of every one as the old saying goes "a picture is worth more then a 1000 words". The problem in the beginning was that the computers were not able to handle the larger up front memory for the graphics. But not any more as computer power is more then capable and improving by the day.
In Powerproject you use the screen to draw the bars and logic links, or not if did not wish to. And it uses "drag and drop" to add calendars, resources, Codes, etc, etc on to the bars. It is all-graphical and yet it can do all the you could do with the "other way of working" and it does it better. I am not going to attempt list the vast capability and specification of Powerproject, but I would urge you to get yourself a demonstration copy and experience it’s power and ease of use.
Regards
Daya

Hi Tim.
I’ve been using various planning packages on major projects [£100M+ range]in the uk for some time. Currently I use both Powerproject V8 and Primavera P3.1 for both live project management and claims situations. I have also used Plantrac , Open Plan and Pertmaster again on major projects for live management and claims analysis.
Clearly if you are to invest in new software you need to get the one that best suits you companie’s purpose, particularly the software cost is dwarfed by the cost in time and possable training in learning to use it effectively.
P3 is stable and reliable and comes into its own when interfacing with other databases via the activity ID, but Open Plan is better than P3 at this though and has reliable logic CPA processing [see below].
However as a management tool to build up an as built record and to update the critical path, resource to completion and to easily and reliably forecast completion of projects i’m not so happy with it.
Key drawbacks are.
1. FF lag links adopt the predecessor calendar. P3 is the only software, to my knowledge, to have this flaw. it is particularly dangerous whereyou have projects with many different calendars. If you have a network that seems fine and an activity runs a bit behind to be at or close to its non working period the successor activity will be made to jump across the predecessors nonworking period by the FFlag, thus falsely delaying the sucessor. Thus great care is needed to check behaviour of FF lag links at every progress update and in delay analysis. In a recient project a Forensic programme expert we employed to look at our claim insisted that all the FF lag links were removed from our 3000 activity network and the succeeding activities had to be split into two at the link or an extra milestone work arround used between the original activities.
2. As the project progresses P3 only shows the start and finish of an activity with a long line in between. Also resources attached to the activity are spread along it. Thus you can’t easily see when an activity was actually being progressed and the histogrammes and graphs to the left of time now are all false, you have to keep exporting data to excel or whatever to keep the true record.
3. P3 is difficult it the way it handles fixed resources[contrete volumes, Te of Steel] it has a tendancy to change the resources as you change activity durations. Most softwares have two basic resource types Fixed as described and variable [ cranes people etc] You have to be extremely carful how you set up the resources and even more careful when putting in progress as the resource progressing with activity progress is not reliable, resource progress has to be input seperately as well and this makes for time consuming progress updates and reporting to managers.
4. P3 is is now a bit dated in its presentation and is relatively slow and cumbersome to use particularly for what-if and contingency planning.

The software of choice for myself is Powerprojects V8.
It handles large projects quickly and efficiently and the logic does exactly what you intend. you can also assign link codes so you can identify and track logic links and process the network with specified logic switched on or off. Very useful for ’resource’ and ’what if’ logic tracking. It has a spell checker and an unlimited undo feature. It also has a logic display feature which for any number of selected activities gives a barchart with logic links of all the activities connected to your selection. Great for tracking and the design team liked these printed out to have a personalised chart of all the inputs and outputs to their particular activities. Good for communication and getting buy in to the programme.

Progress input is very quick and it reliably progresses resources, the progressed portion is split away from the main bar and thus histogrammes and graphs are allways reliable to the left of time now and the remaining activity and its resouces are reliable in the forecast to completion. This occours within the software without the need to export data evey time you do an update. At the end of the project you automatically have an excellent as built barchart and resource useage with no exra effort.
You can set up particular barcharts comprised of summary bars which can ’contain’ any mix of activities from the main programme. once you have set up a summary view of the project that managers like it is there for the whole project and as you update the detail this view will update itself reliably.
PP annotation of bars is unrivalled in my view and can contain salient data items and are fully formatable. So you can have notes or key activity data on your charts which automatically update themselves as progress is input or the activity / summary /hammock changes, so again reliable updates to managers with no extra effort
Simarly you can quickly and easily produce tabular reports of detailed or sulmmarised activities or resources.
On PP the progress on summary bars, hammocks and so on is reliable and accurate, in particular it calculates the progress position along the bar correctly, most other software’s i’ve used are abysmal at this and you have to export data to excel or similar and compare to baseline curves.
PP shows calendars and other nonworking periods on the bar-chart [if you wish] for every activity and can highlight periods of time or specific dates globally. Thus in a project with lots of different calendars [my last one had 20+ different calendars of external constrains, environmental seasons and activity non working periods] PP is excellent and makes explaining them to managers/clients etc very easy. P3 is useless at showing calendars.

In the round PP is both a competent CPA tool and an excellent presentational tool, quick and reliable to use and is highly adaptable to different projects and management requirements. It is highly adaptable and new summaries / graphs / reports that are asked for during a project are quick and easy to produce and will automatically have correct historical and forecast data.
My final point would be that on a £170M project for a major government client they scored our KPI for Planning and Programme with the highest possible mark, they were particularly impressed with the presentation, progress updating and reliable forecasting. QED. Poweprojects is the one for the 21st century.
Good luck in your choice and try them all out 1st.
regards JK

Hi David,

I see the PowerProject / Teamplan vs others debate still continues!

I too have been using PowerProject since its early GEM days and I must say that I haven’t looked back since. This is no doubt partly due to its wide use and acceptance in the construction industry in the UK, plus its ease of functionality etc. I suppose my own preference for this software makes me biased in giving an opinion when comparing different packages, but one only has to consider why so many people use it in the UK. It can only be that people like using it.

What does surprise me though is why do Planning Planet still refuse to accept its popularity? You just have to click on the “Voting” link at the top of every page on Planning Planet to be taken to a section where you can vote for which planning software package do you prefer. Whilst you can vote for Primavera, Artemis, Open Plan, Schedule Publisher or Microsoft Project, the one notable exception (at least as far as users in the UK are concerned) is PowerProject / Teamplan.

I totally agree with your sentiments about communicating your plans to others. In my opinion, good planning engineers are not those who can produce the most complicated, technically correct programmes, but those who can best communicate their programmes to others simply and effectively. Planning is 70% communication and 30% technical ability. Personally, I prefer to produce a very simple programme and support it with diagrams or drawings showing how and when I anticipate the building will be constructed. To me, it doesn’t really matter what programming software is used – most of the time the recipients are merely looking at printed barcharts, which at the end of the day are all very similar.

Very often, I too just want to paint pictures!

Regards.

Gary France

Tim,
Don’t know so much that it was advise. If you have used P3 for "such a long time", (I was only about 5 back then),then you are very aware of its capability. Do go ahead and trial PP and or TP, you will understand fully, the reasons that may make you shy of using TP as your No.1 software for planning. PP is a great little tool though. And always a good idea to have it in the background. Did the initial induction of P3ec some time ago now. Perhaps if all our PM’s and Directorate were Planning geared, they would sign off on P3ec. I would certainly love to trial it for a couple of years. But even to do that, there is a lot of fiddling about. It looks quite a challenge, but looks extremly powerful.

Regards
Darrell,

Thank you very much for your advice of moving from PowerProject to P3, I was looking the other way, P3 to Powerproject but from your comments, it would seem a poor mans choice.
I have been a P3 user since dos days in 1987 but the cost of the move P3 to P3ec is extreme in SQL servers, network, and training. Constrcution companies have never been flush with funds on IT expenditure, unlike banks and others which is the new PM market for Primavera. With P3 and suretrack as a 16 bit application and P3ec 32 bit we have to change at sometime. Also Primavera are not providing any further development to P3/suretrack only good support if you maintnece agreement is up to date. Other construction companies are sitting on their hands as well seeing what esle is out there.

Regards

Tim Readman

RE: Popularity of Powerproject/Teamplan
Tim,
Points noted.
Moved over from Powerproject to P3. Not an easy learning curve at all. But for all those logic & network based Planners out there it should be fairly smooth. You are not allowed to just paint pictures. P3 & me have had our issues, but generally I have found their technical help desk, exceptionally useful. Most issues with them are resolved at least within 24 hours. And usually resolved immediately over the phone. The Calendars are simple and multiple on any chart, you can plan down to the minute. Very easy to establish labour & cost charts, histograms & curves. Target programmes or base line programmes easy also. Progressing & updating & reporting a piece of P**s. Presentation used to look very cold, but to my mind, now outstripps anything PP or TP can do, you can also have live links for presentation to almost any MS application or other data stored on your server or hard drive, disc etc. Magnificent for handling large or huge amounts of data.

Over the years have become more & more impressed with its functionality & flexibility. What more can I say.

Perhaps trial it against TP for 6-12 months, run two projects concurrent and decide for yourself. It is not the cheapest software out there, butt perhaps you get what you pay for??? This is not justifying P3 cost.

Hope these comments are of use.
Regards,
Darrell


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I have just picked up a demo version of powerproject to compare with p3/Suretrack as a possible migration rather than to p3ec.

Is there anyone out there in the planning planet who has moved from the primavera enviroment to the Powerproject area and found it a better way to go for the construction planners world?. The comments is several of this forums has been mixed. Is there an idependant survey of the packages available?.

We need reliable logic to prove EOT claims, and last the distance of projects from tender, desgin development, procurement, construction, commissioning, maintance. Then perhaps prove and show what ifs, delays, problems etc.
We need multiple layouts/views to show overall schedules to clients, sub contractors, site managers,etc multiple calenders, and databases.

The software must be able to handle 6000 activites or more fast an relaible. Can powerproject do all this?

Tim Readman

Darrell,
I was intersted to note your comments about Powerproject and Team plan. I have used Powerproject for 16+ years and have really appreciated it’s ease of use. However, in my experience, it has always struggled with projects containing a large number of activities, particularly when progressing. I am now having similar problems Teamplan and would be interested in hearing about anyone with similar experiences.

I have just picked up a demo version of powerproject to compare with p3/Suretrack as a possible migration rather than to p3ec.

Is there anyone out there in the planning planet who has moved from the primavera enviroment to the Powerproject area and found it a better way to go for the construction planners world?. The comments is several of this forums has been mixed. Is there an idependant survey of the packages available?.

We need reliable logic to prove EOT claims, and last the distance of projects from tender, desgin development, procurement, construction, commissioning, maintance. Then perhaps prove and show what ifs, delays, problems etc.
We need multiple layouts/views to show overall schedules to clients, sub contractors, site managers,etc multiple calenders, and databases.

The software must be able to handle 6000 activites or more fast an relaible. Can powerproject do all this?

Tim Readman

I am writing as the Marketing Manager at Asta Development.
The change from version 5 of Powerproject to version 6 was a real change for our users and marked a step-change in the product into a more powerful project management system. The new features were based on requests from our users (we run a user-based wish-list which gets voted on at 8 regional UK user group meetings twice a year).

An example of a major change in functionality between version 5 and 6 was calendars. In version 5, the smallest time unit you could plan in was half-days. Lots of our users wanted to be able to plan in hours - one or two even in minutes - and this was added to version 6. Also, in version 5, you couldn’t set up working patterns whereas in version 6 you can set up working patterns that precisely reflect which hours will be worked in the day.

Another example of major change in the interface was the introduction of a ProjectView - a way of navigating through a hierachical structure of projects, sub-projects, resources, costs etc. This feature can be switched off for those user who don’t need it.

One feature that was popular in version 5 that wasn’t included in version 6 was standalone histograms. This is now back in the latest version of Powerproject (version 8).

So, Powerproject is still the most easy to use & feature rich product on the market - and good value for money when compared to P3. We do run training courses for users going from version 5 to the latest version of Powerproject - something we’d recommend in order to get the most out of the software.

Hi Gavin
I started using Power Project approximately 12 years ago and enjoyed using it (whilst using Sure Trak, P3, MS Project, and Open Plan) as it developed itself continously.
When Team Plan ie Ver 7 was released I had to re-learn how to use PowerProject because the menu and feel was quite different from Ver 5. However I find it has many very useful features, but miss some of the functions in ver 5 that were not included in ver 7. On the whole it is a better and more powerfull bit of planning software especially with the sort and filter functions, un do facility, importing baselines, to name but a few.
Regards
Daya

Gavin
It POWERPROJECT not POWERPOINT!
Daya

I would expect that planners would use more then one planning software and that may be the reason why it adds up to more then 100%.
The next survey could ask for the software one uses and the one they prefer to use for the various different types of projects?
Regards
Daya